So I downloaded the GCE video, just to see whether or not “UCG 1995″ was coming to pass. Here are my impressions of UCG’s May 2nd “Sabbath Services”, blow-by-blow.
- Song leader can’t sing. No surprise there. Not very enthusiastic with the song leading either.
- What the hell are they singing?! The titles are foreign, and the tunes don’t sound familiar.
- Crap. We never sounded that bad, did we? Yeah, yeah we probably did.
- Sounds like every single opening prayer I ever bowed my head through.
- Announcements — ooooh, didja see the look on his face over “9 o’clock PM”?? Heads are gonna roll for that one.
- Special music — What, the choir still can’t sing? Yeah, guess not.
- Filing off in eerie silence. Applause is still not allowed in services. Wonder if they applaud for Kilough the way we used to applaud for Armstrong, and then Tkach?
- Why has the lectern grown end tables?!
- “An entire auditorium full of people from all over the world” — I daresay a smaller number than the FoT used to be.
- Why their obssession with the number of connections? And how many of those were mockers and critics??
- 447 elders
- Wait, what? 447 ELDERS. For the entire CHURCH?? Yowza. That’s miniscule. That would have been a mid-sized congregation, back in the day. I guess they didn’t get as many walkaways as had been generally assumed, after the changes. Or maybe I haven’t been keeping track.
- ID badge — “Where your tithe dollars went.”
- Last words of Christ — what, again? Have heard that before.
- “The King James and the New King James do us a disservice, really.” Say what?! I can see why the hard-liners scoff at UCG.
- Matt 28:19: “Most translations and commentaries, correcting the King James and New King James….” Is this a new development for UCG? All the verses in the Sermon Archive appear to be using the NKJV.
- HAH! Guess not: UCG prefers the “Modern King James”. Status quo.
- Is he about to break into song?! Go Ye Therefore Into All the World was the only song we sang, Sabbath after Sabbath, post-changes.
- “Making disciples” — only by the elders, is the unspoken implication.
- Yeah I’ll bet they’re desperate for disciples — those tithe dollars must be getting thin on the ground.
- Reminiscing about the ’80s and the Gestapo Visiting Committee. OK, maybe things aren’t changing.
- Three visits before you’re in the door. Is this still policy with UCG?
- 7 Critical Factors for Victim Recruitment
1. “We don’t set the boundaries for discipling.”
-
- An “unusual body” in the Christian world. (No shit, Sherlock.)
- An “unusual body” in the Christian world. (No shit, Sherlock.)
2. Our fundamental beliefs:
- John 6:44 No Evangelizing — This is status quo. Matt. 13 God calls people, the church doesn’t call people. Same old, same old. The worldly are deceived and do not understand. Status quo. Professing Christianity has it wrong, salvation is deferred to Kingdom Come. Status quo. Gestapo Visiting Committee is still in effect. Boundaries are established by God. None of this has changed from the old church.
- Environment which God brings a disciple to is critically important. Don’t scare away the fresh meat away, we need the tithe slaves, now more than ever.
- God’s Master Plan, Kingdom Come, First Res. Status quo.
- Members evangelize through their behaviour, not professing. Same old same old.
- “Sermons We See”, by Edgar Guest — carefully censored.
3. Communicating is easier than at any time in history. Reaching people is harder than at any time in the last century.
- There are too many splinters for people to choose from.
- Reminiscing about the “good old days”. The Ambassador College Oratorial Style will never, ever, ever change.
- The radio broadcast was the epitome of the church. There are too many choices now.
- IPods are evil, they allow individuals to choose what they want. Menu-driven world.
- Potential victims arrive at the place of being introduced into the church in a menu-driven fashion.
- Having “all the answers” still works at sucking new recruits in. Small wonder: 68% of the tithes are spent on literature!!
- “How was Bob called to the church?”
- Too many TV channels.
- Too many radio stations.
- KYLE-ough? I thought it was KILL-ough.
- 112 different “ministries” on one TV channel, 16 different religions. TBN, 55 different broadcasts and 29 religions. Sunday-keeping broadcasts on general cable 6am – 7pm, 62 different programs, outside of the specialty channels.
- Everything that represents the church goes on one website.
- The “clatter and the noise” of the others is “unbelievable”. [Still dissing the professing Christians.]
- The point? “Satan is the Prince of the power of the air.” Dissing other religions and ministries. Status quo.
- “The gates of hell will not prevail against God’s church.”
4. “Herbert W. Armstrong’s legacy is a two-edged sword when it comes to discipling.” No shit, Sherlock. Buuuuuuut:
- “Now, don’t get ahead of me on this one…” Want some maple syrup on those waffles, Bob? “…because I doubt you know where I’m going.” Talking down to the sheeple. Status quo.
- “Let me say that again: Herbert W. Armstrong’s legacy is a two-edged sword when it comes to discipling.”
- SDAs tried to recruit UCG in 1995. “Herbert W. Armstrong did more to make the Sabbath known om this world in the 20th century than any other human being.” Flattery didn’t get them the UCG though.
- NO ONE PREACHED END TIME PROPHECY AS WE DID.
- No one identified Easter and Christmas “for what they were”.
- Nobody advocated for honouring the Biblical holy days, [dismissive shrug] unless they were Jewish.
- No one in the name of religion raised issues such as dietary laws [No mention of the Jews here, oddly enough] and “other issues”.
- “We were an island. Those particular statements you would hear from the World Tomorrow, you’d hear them debunked, or see them debunked and [unintelligible], but you didn’t hear them.”
- A prophet is never recognized in his own country. (Still talking about Herbie? Yep.)
- “We are no longer a unique voice on many topics. We are STILL a unique package.”
- Messianic Judaism and Pre-millenialists are soaking up Church of God nuttiness, specifically non-aligned community churches. [Is UCG aiming for independent non-denominational congregations then? Better to go after larger groups, than individual victims. Better long-term income strategy.]
- Pagan origins of Christian holidays are being recognized by “the world”. [Thus, they are not "making changes", but perhaps pushing the idea that maybe the Kingdom is closer, because more people are starting to sway towards Armstrong-like and Adventist belief systems.]
- “We don’t fully grasp the impact [of Armstrongism] on ALL OF AMERICAN CHRISTIANITY.
- [So UCG's approach is, "They're starting to fall in line with us! Must be the end times!" ???]
- “I don’t know anyone that has our package, hard to reach people who are just looking for salads or desserts.” [Still dissing those professing Christians.]
5. Those 40 and below are not necessarily in love with the religion of those 40 and over.
- “That puts almost all of us in this room in jeopardy.”
- Younger Americans are increasingly turned off by the religion of their forebears. [How to recruit younger victims.]
- “The unchurched younger American is not so sophisticated as to distinguish us from all the rest.”
6. “To make a disciple, we have to be in love with our own message.”
- When Bob was first thrown into the ranks of the Gestapo. Early 1960s, good times, good times.
- “Don’t try to convert your relatives.” john 6:44, Matt. 13
- Miracles in Mark. [What about the contradictions in Mark, Bob?]
- “There is no better salesman than the person who believes he has found the greatest thing on the face of earth.”
- We are generationally a very mature church. 5 generations deep in Portland.
- Those who were born into the church don’t have the beauty of God’s calling. [Same thing was preached in the '80s.]
- [Bob speaks of FoT 1973 but no mention of "1975 in Prophecy", I note.]
- [Bob's grandfather sounds like a cool open-minded kind of guy. Pity the church sucked his grandparents and the rest of the family, in.]
- “Our history of discipling is one of massive media coverage and passionately motivated followers.”
7. “The tone of our message must match the tone of God’s message.”
- Tone outstrips everything else.
- “Deeply embedded into the culture of the Church of God that an End Time warning has, or will, or has AND will, be given to this world.” [sic]
- First warning message was in Garden of Eden. There have been warning messages ever since. “Consider the tone.”
- “God loves this world. He loves all of this world.” [This world that is deceived by Satan, don't forget.]
- “Greetings friends,” the tone of the voice was convicted, unwavering and loud.
- Bob never sensed the tone of contempt or superiority or time-serving. [Don't know which broadcast Bob was listening to. Does Bob know Herbie ganked "Greetings, Friends," from the Quakers??]
- Gestapo reminiscences of a visiting committee to the spiritually widowed.
- The “joy” of the spiritually dead spouse being called.
- Romans 11:7-8. The world is deceived. [Status quo.]
- Rom. 11: 30-32. [Notice how Bob skipped the verses in Romans favoured by professing Christians?]
- Pre-millenial madness again.
- “We have been branded in the earlier years of our existence as sect, as cult, it has made us very defensive. We can’t afford to live there.” [NO SHIT SHERLOCK.]
- “There is never an enemy of God who cannot one day be a deeply-cherished brother.”
- “All that we understand from Biblical prophecy about certain peoples.” [STATUS QUO BI!]
In conclusion:
- Isaiah 19:23 – 25 – OK that sold me, United IS “gawd’s troo church”. Pity that god isn’t what they think he is.
- Preaching “the universal good news” of the Church of God. [This is every single sermon I ever heard in the 1980s, people.]
- Contemporary English Version Hosea 11:1-8. “Beautiful and powerful illustration of the reality we have to remember.” Bob doesn’t believe church members treat their unconverted children badly, and extends this delusion to the god he has created out of the picture in the Old Testament.
- God loves you, but doesn’t always like you.
- Wait, what?!
- God loves you, but doesn’t always like you. They’re not kidding when they say no one has their package.
- British-Israelism implied in the verses about Assyria.
- Equating the church with Israel.
- God loves you, but doesn’t always like you.
- Ezek. 9:1-6 Back to the KJV.
- Commentators got it wrong.
- A vengeful, wrathful god, so you better fall in line like a good little sheep.
- “Set a mark on the forehead of those who sigh and cry for all the abominations that have been done.” A reference to “the desolation of abomination” of the changes??
- Church members are equated to being Lot in Sodom and Gomorrah.
- Preaching the Gospel means “lives changed”. [But no evangelizing. STATUS FUCKING QUO.]
Guess they don’t applaud for Dicks then.
And yep, you guessed it: They sing Go Ye Therefore Into All the World at the end. Don’t forget the verse about Those who do believe and are baptized/Shall be saved while others are condemned.
Well, after that hour and a half of my life that I am never, ever, ever going to get back, my assessment is thus: There will be no “changes” in United. Rather, what Bob Dick is preaching, is a return to the hardest of the hard-line Armstrongism; he, and the UCG Council of Elders, seeks a revival of the 1950s and ’60s, when the church was starting to grow exponentially. (Driven, you will note, by 1975 in Prophecy, but still.) At several points during the sermon, you could see where he was comparing the present-day UCG to the proto-church in Portland of the mid-1930s.
We know the difference of course.
United Church of God preaching a doctrine of “the changes”? Sadly, no. That part of the parallel universe of Armstrongism, really did make it through the changes of WCG perfectly unscathed — and absolutely unchanged in any way whatsoever.


Wednesday, 6. May 2009
We ain’t going to be getting the remains of any of our loved ones from these Zombies any time soon. Crap!
BB
[Reply]
AggieAtheist Reply:
May 6th, 2009 at 9:40 pm
Sorry Bob. It’s like time stood still. They’re even following the “dress 10 to 15 years behind the fashions” dictate of the “Get the church back on TRACK!” era. If it’s any consolation, your family member in United is probably there only because it is exactly the church that existed pre-Tkach “reformation”.
As I have pointed out repeatedly, what would posses people to think this is a good thing??
[Reply]
Wednesday, 6. May 2009
I half-listened to Dick’s sermon while doing other stuff. I came to the same conclusion that you did. My sibling will continue to attend UCG. Unless they update too much, as he’s on the high side of 40.
[Reply]
AggieAtheist Reply:
May 6th, 2009 at 9:42 pm
Sorry, Mike. As I said to Bob, the most compelling reason I can see for staying in United would be because nothing changed. Matter of fact, if circumstances had been different, I would probably be in United myself right now…….
[Reply]
Wednesday, 6. May 2009
Sure am glad I didn’t bother downloading the sermon. It is refreshing hearing what they are preaching and knowing that I now see it as the total bullshit and delusion that it is.
Life is good.
[Reply]
AggieAtheist Reply:
May 6th, 2009 at 9:48 pm
Yep. The saddest part is, they are deluded in exactly the same way they were deluded before. All those splinter-hoppers looking for “god’s true church”?? Right here, yo. Nothing, nothing, NOTHING has changed as far as UCG is concerned.
Well, except the size, which is a positive thing. Hopefully they will continue to get smaller and smaller, and will eventually devolve into nothingness.
I have to wonder, though, at Russell’s “source” who started all this —- I didn’t hear Dick say a single thing that even REMOTELY suggested that they believe there are Christians in other churches; his whole spiel was “Gawd’s Troooth is so great, they’re ON OUR TURF.” (He actually said “on our turf”, BTW.) Cue the “we let our godly LIVES evangelize, brethren,” and I’m telling you, United IS “the church”, at least it’s a carbon copy of the church I remember. It’s eerie, how much of the parallel universe has actually survived…..Eerie, and depressing.
[Reply]
Thursday, 7. May 2009
Man, talk about Deja Vu! How hard it must have been for you to listen to that shit – it was hard for me to read it. I could hear the voices and the “music” in my head. I felt such feelings of revulsion at the arrogance and brain-washing tactics, insinuations, etc. Ugh! Nope, they haven’t changed a bit for the better, only for the worse.
[Reply]
AggieAtheist Reply:
May 7th, 2009 at 8:56 am
Meh, I’m past the point where the shit spooks me. I’m just depressed that the “winds of change” rumour turned out to be absolutely unfounded. I would disagree that they’ve changed for the worse, however; after sitting through that hour and a half glimpse into the parallel universe I was born in, I can definitively say they haven’t changed at all.
Which is, I guess, rather the point. For the tithe slaves anyway.
[Reply]
Charlie Reply:
May 8th, 2009 at 3:16 am
Ditto what incredulous wrote.
[Reply]
Thursday, 7. May 2009
The good news is indeed the size, Aggie. 10-11,000 is miniscule. They have been totally marginalized by this, and we have to remember that this is the big splinter!
When you consider the fact that United’s 10,000 are spread out all across North America, how much influence could they possibly have?
This was an interesting walk down memory lane, and I am positive that it has given all of us a deeper appreciation for our current mindset and circumstances.
I’m always optimistic about family, and basic kinship issues. It would be nice if some day our family could be restored to the wonderful condition that it was in prior to the introduction of Armstrongism. I can’t see that as being even remotely possible so long as some of our relatives are caught up in the cultic mindset. It seems like all of the splinters are under the control of hardliners, so that’s not going to happen.
BB
[Reply]
AggieAtheist Reply:
May 7th, 2009 at 9:00 am
I’m sorry about your family Bob, that sucks. You never know, though; all of us made it out of “the one true church”, regardless of where we ended up.
[Reply]
Thursday, 7. May 2009
Heh. Unfortunately, we’re talking about elders here. They’ve got a lot of reasons not to leave. That’s why I was hoping for a total 1995!
BB
[Reply]
AggieAtheist Reply:
May 7th, 2009 at 3:15 pm
Hmm, well if it was a ‘95 in that case, they would probably just devolve into one of the stricter splinters, unfortunately. Be careful what you wish for, Bob.
[Reply]